To the Right Honorable The Councel of State:
The humble Petition of several Gentlemen, Justices of Peace, Ministers of the Gospel, and People, within the County of Lancaster,
whose names are subscribed.
Sheweth,
THat
George Fox, and
James Nayler, are persons disaffected to Religion, and the wholesome Laws of this Nation; and that since their coming into this Country, have broached Opinions tending to the destruction of the relation of Subjects to their Magistrates, Wives to their Husbands, Children to their Parents, Servants to their Masters, Congregations to their Ministers, and of a People to their God: And have drawn much people after them; many whereof (men, women, and little children) at their meetings are strangely wrought upon in their bodies, and brought to fall, foam at the mouth, roar, and swell in their bellies. And that some of them affirmed
[Page 2]themselves to be equal with God, contrary to the late Act, as hath been attested at a late Quarter-Sessions holden at
Lancaster in
October last past; and since that time, acknowledged before many Witnesses; besides many other dangerous Opinions, and damnable Heresies, as appears by a Schedule hereunto annexed, with the names of the Witnesses subscribed.
May it therefore please your Honours upon the consideration of the Premisses, to provide (as your wisdoms shall think fit) That some speedy course may be taken for the speedy suppressing of these evils.
And your Petitioners shall ever pray, as in duty bound.
1. George
professed and avowed that he was equal with God.
2.
He professed himself to be the Eternal Judge of the world.
3.
He said he was the Judge of the world.
4.
He said he was the Christ, the way, the truth, the life.
5.
He said, Whosoever took a place of Scripture, and made a Sermon of it and from it, was a Conjurer, and his Preaching Conjuration.
6.
He said that the Scripture was carnal.
James Milner,
a follower of the said Fox,
professeth himself to be God and Christ; and gives out Prophecies,
1.
That the day of Judgement shall be the 15
day of November.
2.
That there shall never Judge sit at Lancaster
again.
3.
That he must ere long shake the foundations of the great Synagogue, meaning the Parliament.
Leonard Fell
professeth that Christ had never any body but his Church.
Richard Huberthorn
wrote, that Christs coming in the flesh was but a figure.
The Answer of
George Fox, to the matters falsely charged upon him, by the Petition and
Schedule aforesaid.
Object.
THat George Fox
and James Nayler,
are Persons disaffected to Religion.
Answ. Whereas we are accused as Persons disaffected to Religion, it is false; for pure Religion we own in our souls, which is,
to visit the Fatherless and relieve the Widows, and to keep our selves unspotted from the world, and dwelling in purity; this we owne in our souls.
But he that doth seem to be religious,
Jam. 1.26, 27. Mat. 23.27
and hath not power over his owne tongue, his Religion is vain; and that Religion we do deny: and all them that do profess the Scriptures in words, and live not the life of them but live in drunkenness and uncleanness, envy and maliciousness;
J
[...] 5.31. and all they that do profess Religion, and make a trade of the Scriptures, both Preists and People, we do deny.
Object.
Disaffected to the wholesome laws of the Nation.
Answ. Justice (the wholesome law of God) we owne;
Rom. 13 4, and this is a terrour to the unjust, unwholesome, and unclean: and he that beares that Sword
is a Minister of God;
Isa. 33.22, and who doth not obey the law of God within, then that takes hold upon him without; but who doth obey the law of God within, it brings them from under the occasions of all laws without: for it will not let man lye, nor let him be drunk, nor proud, nor follow oathes, nor cursed speaking, nor whoredoms, quarreling, fighting, wrangling,
[Page 4]nor rayling: and every one who walketh in the law of God, denyes all that which is unwholesome, and that which is according to the course of the world; and they be all of one heart, and are all one in unity, if ten thousand; and have all one law written in their hearts; which those that live in uncleanness cast behind their backs; and yet they profess a law in words, but are not subject to the power of God: and such are they who do accuse their brethren which walk in the law of God; and yet they pretend justice; but their souls are not subject; for that soul that is subject to the higher power which is of God, denyes all filthiness and corruption.
Object.
That since their coming into this Countrey, they have broached Opinions tending to the destruction of the relation of Subjects to their Magistrates, Wives to their Husbands, Children to their Parents, Servants to their Masters, Congregations to their Ministers, and of a People to their God.
Answ. We were moved to come into this Country, of the Lord; and the Lord did let us see, that he had a people here, before we came in it. But as for broaching Opinions, We deny; but those that profess truth, and walk in it up to God, we owne. Opinions do tend to break the relation of Subjects to their Magistrates, Wives to their Husbands, Children to their Parents, Servants to their Masters, Congregations to their Ministers, and of a People to their God; but Opinions we deny; for they are without God; and there you are: and justice and purity is but one, and that we set up and owne: purity and walking in the Spirit, doth make a separation from all uncleanness, and can
have no fellowship with them who are
unfruitful workers of darkness;
Rom. 1.2. but there is a separation from them; the one hath fellowship with God, and the other hath fellowship with darkness, which be unfruitful: the one is separated to God, the other is separated from God.
Object.
Have drawn much people after them; many whereof, Men, Women, and Little-Children, at their meetings, are strangely wrought upon in their bodies, and brought to fall, foam at the mouth, roar, and swell in their bellies.
Answ. The meetings of the people of God,
1 Pet. 4.12 Psa. 71.7. were ever strange to the world; for it was as though some strange thing had happened to the Saints, as ye read in the Scripture; which shew ye are in the same generation,
Act. 13.41. wondring and stranging at the work of the Lord, despising, and casting scandals, slanders, and false reports upon them: and where the works of God are now, they think them strange things now, as was then who are alive in the flesh.
Act. 9.4, 5. It would be a strange thing to see one now fall downe,
Dan. 10.9 as
Paul fell downe and trembled, and as
Daniel fell down and trembled; and to see one as
Habakkuk his belly to tremble, and his lips to quiver,
Hab. 3.16. and as David, to
lye roaring all the day long, who cryed till
his sight was grown dim, and his flesh failed of fatness▪ and till he could
number his bones; and to see one as
Isaiah, to
rent his garment and his mantle, and
pluck his hair off his head, and off his beard, and
sit down astonished:
Isa. 66.5. and would it not be strange to see such an Assembly as came to
Isaiah▪ which had all trembling hearts?
Hear the word of the Lord, all ye that tremble at his word; Work out your salvation with fear and trembling: Before their faces the people shall be much pained:
Joel 2.6.
all faces shall gather blackness. The Prophets and Ministers of God have all one Spirit (according to measure) and did encourage those that did tremble; wherein it shews that you have not the same Spirit, but seek to persecute, and fix scandals, and accuse them falsly. The Ministery of truth ever drew from all the Ministry of the world, and from under all the laws of the world, up to God, and from all the Gods of the earth and then they witnessed that the Lord was their Law-giver, the Lord was their King, the Lord was their Judge.
Object. George Fox
professed and avowed that he was equal with God.
Answ. It was not so spoken, as
George Fox was equal with God: but the Father and the Son is one:
John 14.9, 10.
I and my Father are one; and where the same is revealed, this is witnessed: but where the same is not made manifest and revealed, Christ is persecuted; for the world knows him not.
Let the same minde be in you,
Phil. 2.5, 6, 7.
that was also, in Christ Jesus, who being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God, and yet made himself
[Page 6]of no reputation: And this I witness to be fulfilled; for the same Spirit where it is, is equal with God: for
he that sanctifieth, and they that are sanctified, are all of one; and it is God that sanctifieth:
Heb 2.11. Jude 1. Joh. 1.1. 1 Cor. 15.47, 48. 1 Joh. 3.7.
He that hath the Word hath God, for God is the Word; and our fellowship is with God. There is a natural man, and there is a spiritual man: the the first is of the earth earthly, the second is the Lord from heaven: the new man, which is created after God in righteousness and true holiness; and he that doth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous. And this I witness, what the Scripture saith,
Let no man deceive you.
Object.
He professeth himself to be the eternal Judge of the world.
Answ. He that was a Minister of God, said,
that the Saints should judge the world,
1 Cor. 6.2, 3. yea,
Angels: herein they do shew themselves to be no Ministers of God, who seek to persecute them who are judged of God, and justified by him; where
judgement is brought forth unto victory,
Mat. 12.20 and set in the earth; and that which is eternal, hath judged all the carnal nature in himself; and where it is judged, thereis no unity with it, where it is alive; and he that hath not true judgement,
Mat. 5.13, 14. and Salt in himself to savour withall, is good for nothing, and he cannot endure that Christ should speak where he is made manifest.
I am the way, saith Christ; Christ is but one in all his Saints,
1 Cor. 11.3 Mar. 13.11 and he speaks in them; but he doth not say that
George Fox is Christ:
I am the way, the truth, & the life: Christ is the light, and ye are the light, and Christ liveth in you, and Christ is the head of the man; and it is the Spirit of the Father that speaketh in you, and spoke in Christ, and he is but one in in all his Saints:
Isa. 5.20. without are many Christs;
Lo here, and lo there; but
know you not that Christ is in you except ye be Reprobates? and if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; and there Christ Jesus speaks,
the same Christ to day, yesterday, and for ever. And thy judgement, which is not eternal, is carnal; and with evil thoughts thou judgest: thou
puttest darkness for light, and light for darkness; and here thou shewest thy judgement to be carnal, and no Minister of God, but a
Minister of the Letter, and
not of the Spirit; for the Ministers of the Spirit
[Page 7]have true judgement, and did imprison none, nor persecute, as you do: but it is, that fools may utter forth their folly.
Object.
He said he was the way, the truth, the life.
Answ. The old man cannot endure to hear the new man speak,
John 14.6. which is Christ; and Christ is the way: and if Christ be in you, must not he say.
I am the way, the truth, and the life?
John 10.4. Now if Antichrist speak, he is owned of the world; but he cannot witness it; while the old man raignes, the voice of God is not known, nor Christ himself to speak in man, but Christs sheep know his voyce.
Object.
He said, Whosoever took a place of Scripture, and made a Sermon of it, or from it, was a Conjurer, and his preaching was Conjuration.
Answ. He that puts the Letter for the light,
John 8.12. when the Letter saith that Christ is the light, he is blind; and they that say the Letter and the Spirit are inseparable, when the Spirit saith the Letter is death, and killeth, and all that do study to raise a living thing out of a dead, to raise the Spirit out of the Letter, are Conjurers, and draw points, and reasons,
Jer. 23.16. Jer. 27.9, 10. and so speak a divination of their own brain: they are Conjurers and Diviners, and their teaching is from Conjuration, which is not spoken from the mouth of the Lord and the Lord is against all such; and who are of God, are against all such; for that doctrine doth not profit the people at al, for it stands not in the councel of God, but is a doctrine of the Devil, and draws people from God; but he that speaks from the mouth of the Lord, turnes people from their wickedness:
Heb. 8.11. but that Ministery which God hath not sent, and that Assembly must be disaffected: for the Lord is coming to teach his people himself, by his Spirit.
Object. George Fox
said the Scripture was carnal.
Answ. The Letter of the Scripture is carnal, and the Letter is death, and
killeth, but the Spirit giveth life,
Heb. 7.16. which was in them that gave forth the Scriptures and that I witness, which is eternal and not carnal: for the
Jewes which had the Letter, persecuted Jesus Christ the Substance: and so do you now, which have the Letter, and not the Substance; there were Ministers of the Letter then, and Ministers of the Spirit, so is there is now; the same
[Page 8]Christ being made manifest,
Col. 1.27. is unknown to the world; for the
whole world lyeth in wickedness; and Christ Jesus is a Mystery to the world, and is hid, though you may profess him, because the Letter speaketh of him;
1 Joh. 3.8. but ye persecute him where he is made manifest; and where he is made manifest, the works of the Devil are destroyed, and there he speaks, and is King, and is
the way, and
is the truth,
1 Joh. 5.12. Rom. 8.11. 1 Cor. 6.17 2 Cor. 6.16. and is
the life; and
he that hath the Son, hath life, and
he that hath not the Son, hath not life; and he that hath the same Spirit that raised up Jesus Christ, is equal with God: and the Scripture saith, that God will dwell in man, and walk in man; as Jesus Christ, which is the mystery, hath passed before, so the same Spirit takes upon it the same seed, and is the same where it is made manifest: According to the flesh, I am the son of
Abraham; according to the Spirit, the son of God, saith Christ.
Col. 1.27. Heb. 2.16. All the plotting of the Priests is, and ever was, against Christ where he is made manifest:
and the Beast shall make war with the Saints, and with the Lamb; but the Lamb shall get the victory: praises, praises be to our God for ever, for evermore.
Object. Richard Hubethorne
writ, that Christs coming in the flesh, was but a figure.
Answ. Christ in his people, is the substance of all figures, types, and shadows, fulfilling them in them, and setting them free from them; but, as he is held forth in the Scripture-Letter without them, and in the flesh without them, he is their example or figure, which is both one, that the same things might befulfilled in them, that was in Christ Jesus:
1 Pet. 2.21 1 Pet. 4.1.
for even hereunto were ye called, because Christ hath suffered for us, leaving us an example that we should follow his steps: forasmuch as Christ hath suffered for us, arm your selves likewise with the same mind.
1 Pet. 1.15. Christ was our example in suffering, and in holiness; and as he which hath called you is holy,
Joh. 13.15. so be ye holy in all manner of conversation, because it is written,
Be ye holy as I am holy. He is our example in humility:
I have given you an example (saith Christ) that ye should do even as I have done unto you; And
as he is, so are we in this world; He is
our forerunner, Captain of our Salvation, and in all things our example.
Tit. 16.
As they have done unto me, so shall they do unto you. But all they who have not Christ dwelling in
[Page 9]them go about to persecute him in all them in whom he is made manifest; they neither follow him as an example themselves, nor suffer others to follow him as an example and walk in the same steps; but deny him both as the substance and example, of his people: but they who are taught of him, do confess him both as he is the substance of all things, and their example in all things; for
without me ye can do nothing, saith Christ: and it is so I witness it.
And as for
James Millner, though his minde did run out from his condition, and from minding that light of God which is in him, whereby the world takes occasion to speak against the truth, and many friends stumble at it; yet there is a pure seed in him.
Object. Leonard Fell
said that Christ had no Body but his Church.
Answ.
There is one Body, and one Spirit,
Eph. 4.4. Col. 1.18. 2 Cor. 5.19
even as ye are called into one hope of your calling; and Christ Jesus is the head of the Body the Church, and ye are made free from sin by the Body of Christ; and Christ came to
redeem his Church; God was in Christ reconciling the world to himself, for his body's sake,
Col. 1.24. Eph. 5.30, 32. Eph. 22.23 which is his Church.
For we are members of his Body, of his Flesh, and of his Bones: this is a great Mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and his Church. And hath put all things under his feet, and gave him to be the head over all things to the Church, which is his body, The fulness of him that filleth all in all. In whom also we are builded up together, for an habitation of God through the Spirit.
More Objections against
George Fox, charged upon him, by the Contrivers of the foresaid
Petition; and Answered by him, as followeth.
Object. 1.
THat he did affirm that he had the Divinity essentially in him.
Answ.
2 Cor. 6.1. Eph. 4.6. 2 Pet. 1.4. For the word
essential, it is an expression of their own: but that the Saints are
the Temples of God and God doth
dwell in them, that the Scriptures do witness; and if God dwell in them, then the Divinity dwels in them; and the Scripture saith,
Ye shall be partakers of the divine nature: and this I witness; but where this is not, they cannot witness it.
Object. 2.
That both Baptism and the Lords Supper are unlawful.
Answ. As for that word
unlawful, it was not spoken by me; but, the Baptism of Infants I deny; and there is no Scripture that speaks of a Sacrament, but that Baptism that is into Christ, with
one spirit,
Gal. 3.27.
into one body; that I confess according to Scripture: and the Lords Supper I confess, and that the bread the Saints break,
Iob. 6.53, 55. is the body of Christ; and that cup which they drink, is the blood of Christ; this I witness.
Object. 3.
He did disswade men from reading the Scriptures, telling them that it is carnal.
Answ. For disswading men from reading the Scriptures, that is false, for they were given to be read as they are, but not to make a Trade upon;
1 Cor. 2.10, 16. the
Letter is carnal, and
killeth; but that which gave it forth, is spiritual, eternal, and giveth life; and this I witness.
Oject. 4.
That he was equal with God.
Answ.
Heb. 2.11. That was not so spoken; but that
He that sanctifieth, and they that are sanctified, are of one, and the Saints are
[Page 11]all one in the Father and the Son, of his flesh and of his bone; this the Scripture doth witness: And
ye are the sons of God;
Eph. 5.30. and the Father and the Son are one; and
they that are joyned to the Lord, are one spirit; and they that are joyned to an Harlot are one flesh.
Object.
That God taught deceit.
Answ. That is false, and was never spoken by me; God is pure.
Object.
That the Scriptures are Antichrist.
Answ. That is false; but that they which profess the Scriptures, and live not in the life and power of them, as they did that gave them forth, that I witness to be Antichrist.
Object.
That he was the Judg of the world.
1 Cor. 6.2, 3.
Answ. That
the Saints shall judge the world, the Scripture witness it▪ whereof I am one, and I witness the Scripture fulfilled.
Object.
That he was as upright as Christ.
Answ. Those words were not so spoken by me;
1 Joh. 4.17. 2 Cor. 5.21. Ioh. 17.21, 22. Eph. 4.11, 12, 13. but that
as he is, so are we in this present world; That the Saints are made
the righteousness of God; That the Saints are one in the Father and the Son, that
we shall be like him, 1 Joh. 3.2. and that all teaching which is given forth by Christ, is to bring the Saints to perfection, even
to the measure of the stature, of the fulness of Christ; This the Scripture doth witness, and this I witness. Where Christ dwels, must not he speak in his Temple?
Quaeries propounded to
George Fox, by some of the Contrivers of the Petition, and by him Answered.
Querie.
WHether there be one individual God, distinguished into the Father, Son and Holy Ghost, or not?
Answ. Herein thou wouldest know, whether God be individual, yea or no which is but a busie minde; for had'st thou the witness in thy self, thou wouldst know what he is; but the Heathen know not God, and all that know him not, are Heathen, living in the wicked imaginations of their own hearts; and that is thy condition: For
God is a Spirit, and
none know him, but the Son, and he to whom the Son is revealed; the Son and Word is one.
He that hath ears to hear, let him hear what the Spirit saith; for thou, natural man, thou know'st not the things of God.
Qu.
Whether a believer be justified by Christs righteousness imputed, yea, or no?
Answ. He that believeth, is born of God; and he that is born of God, is justified by Christ alone, without imputation.
Qu.
Whether he that believeth that Christ hath taken away his sin, is clean without sin in this life, as Christ himself, or not?
Answ. He that believeth, is born of God; and
he that is born of God sins not, neither can he sin, because his seed remaineth in him; as he is, so are we, in this present evil world.
Qu.
Whether a believer be without all sin in this life, or not?
Answ. Christ being made manifest, is made manifest to take away sin, and
in him is no sin at all; he that abideth in him, sins not; he that sins, is of the Devil, and hath not seen him,
[Page 13]neither known him: herein are the children of God made manifest, and the children of the Devil. All you that read these Queries, read these things in your selves, whether ye be the children of God, or the children of the Devil; and whether ye understand what ye write, yea, or no.
Qu.
Whether his works, as well as his person, be perfectly holy and good, or no?
Answ. A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit; and
if the root be holy, the branches will be holy also; and
every one that doth righteousness, is righteous, even as he is righteous. But as for that person, it is a busie minde in thee, that askst thou knowst not what; for
God is no respecter of persons: he that respecteth persons, commits sin; and he that commits sin, transgresseth the Law.
Qu.
Whether Saints in this life, without any addition hereafter, are perfectly just, perfectly holy, compleatly glorious, in this life, and are not capable of any addition after death, in the least degree, but only of manifestation?
Answ. If that thou know'st what a Saint is, thou would'st know a Saints life, for they passed thorow death to life; but thou art yet alive to sin, and dead to righteousness; see if it be not so: but he that is dead to sin, is alive to righteousness, and lives in God, and God in him.
The Lord is our righteousness, and he saith,
Be ye holy, as I am holy: for,
without holiness, no man shall see the Lord. Be not deceived. God will not be mocked. Thou hypocrite, dissemble not with him: he that is perfectly holy, is perfectly just: where this is revealed, there needs no addition; for
the man of God is perfect.
Qu.
Whether the two Sacraments, Baptism, and the breaking of Bread, ought necessarily to continue in the Church, or not?
Answ. Thou askest thou know'st not what, concerning two Sacraments, which there is no Scripture for: Thou askest a question, which is an addition to the Scripture; and thou that doest add, the plagues of God are added to thee. Who come into the true Church, are
baptized with one Spirit, into one body; but as for sprinkling Infants, there's no Scripture for it: I deny it in
[Page 14]the true Church of God there is no talk of such carnal things. Thou Sot, the bread which the Saints break, is of the body of Christ; he is
the bread of life. The Church is not the steeplehouse, but the Church is in God, and those that eat the bread of life, live for ever: the Church is in God, and the bread of life is there; and it shall continue for ever.
Qu.
Whether Christ in the flesh, be a figure or not; and if a figure, how, and in what?
Answ. Christ is the substance of all figures; and his flesh is a figure; for every one passeth through the same way as he did, who comes to know Christ in the flesh;
there must be a suffering with him, before there be a rejoycing with him. Christ is an example for all to walk after; and if thou knew'st what an example is, thou wouldst know what a figure is, to come up to the same fulness.
Qu.
Whether there be any heaven or hell, for the Elect or Reprobate after death, but in man in this life, or not?
Answ. There is no knowledge of Heaven or Hell; but through death
the wicked shall be turned into hell, and all them that forget God there to be tormented; there is a hell, thou shalt finde it: Heaven is Gods Throne; and heavenly notions within shall be shaken; for God is pure, and nothing that is unclean shall stand before him; and he hath said he will dwell in man.
Qu.
Whether the ministration of the Ministery by man, is to continue till the end, or not?
Answ. The ministration of the world, is the Ministery of man, and doth not lead to an end, but keeps in time, and that must have an end; for it is not of God. The Ministery of God, is to draw people up to himself; but that is
not of man, nor by man, nor according to man; for
Paul was
made a Minister according to the will of God; who had not received it of man, neither was it taught him of man; and was a Minister of the Spirit: but the Ministers of the world receive their learning at
Oxford and
Cambridge, and are taught of men, and speak a divination of their own brain, which is conjuring; and bewitch the people with those things which are carnal: as, to sprinkle Infants, and tell them of a Sacrament which there is no Scripture for; and saying they are
[Page 15]the Ministers of Christ, and act those things which he forbids, as, to
have the chiefest place in the Assemblies, the uppermost room at feasts, the
greetings in markets, and to be called of men Masters; and
with pretence make long prayers, which Christ forbids; and profess and say, they are the Ministers of Christ: wherein they shew themselves to be Antichrists. And see if thou do not uphold these Antichrists, and say they are the Ministers of Christ.
Qu.
Whether the written Word, I mean the Scriptures, be the power of God unto salvation, to every one that believes, or not?
Answ. The written Word is not the power of God, nor the Scriptures are not the salvation; but he that doth believe, hath the life of them. Who is born of God, shall never die, as it is written; he that believeth, is born of God; and he that is born of God, hath the witness in himself, that God is the cause of mans salvation, and not the Scripture, nor the Letter.
James Nayler's Answer, and Declaration, touching some things charged upon him, by the men aforesaid.
HAving heard of divers untruths cast upon me by some of the Priests in their high places, though I stand only to the Lord in respect of my self; yet lest any that love the truth should be led on, by these false reports to
speak evil of these things they know not; I shall lay open the truth, as it is revealed in me, touching those things whereof I have been falsly accused.
Jude 1
[...].
First, Concerning Jesus Christ, That he is the eternal Word of
[Page 16]God,
Revel. 19.13. 1 Joh. 1.2, 3, 4, 5. Joh. 1.14.
by whom all things were made, and are upholden; which were before all time, but manifested to the world in time, for the recovery of lost man: Which
Word became flesh, and dwelt amongst the Saints; who is
the same yesterday to day, and for ever; who did and doth dwell in the Saints; who suffered, and rose again, and ascended into heaven, and is set at the right hand of God;
Eph. 1.20. to whom
all power is given, in heaven and in earth; who filleth all places, is the light of the world, but known to none, but to those that receive and follow him,
Joh. 8.12. and those he leads up to God, out of all the Wayes, Works, and Worships of the world, by his pure light in them,
2 Thes. 2.8 whereby he reveals
the man of sin; and by his power casts him out and so prepares the bodies of the Saints a fit Temple for the pure God to dwel in; with whom dwels no unclean thing: and thus he reconciles God and man; and the image of God,
1 Cor. 3.16, 17. which is in purity and holiness, is renewed: and the image of Satan, which is all sin and uncleanness, is defaced: and none can witness Redemption,
2 Cor. 5.18, 19. Col. 3.10. further then Christ is thus revealed in them, to set them free from sin: which Christ, I witness to be revealed in me in measure,
Gal. 1.16. 2
Cor. 13.5.
Colos. 1.27.
2.
2 Pet. 1.20, 21. Concerning the Scriptures, That they are a true Declaration of that Word which was in them that spoke them forth, and are of
no private interpretation, but were given forth to be read and fulfilled in the Saints,
Rev. 22.18. as they were given forth by the Holy Ghost, without adding or diminishing; and were not given forth for men to make a Trade on to get mony by: but as they are, they are
profitable for Doctrine,
2 Tim 3.16, 17.
for Reproof, for Correction, for Instruction in righteonsness, that the man of God may be perfect, thorowly furnished unto every good work. But they who trade in the Letter, and are ignorant of the Mystery, deny all perfection; and none can rightly understand the Scriptures, but they who read them with the same Spirit that gave them forth;
1 Cor. 2.14, 15. for
the natural man understands not the things of God: for they are spiritually discerned.
3. Concerning Baptism: The true Baptism is that of the Spirit,
with the Holy Ghost, and with fire: Baptized by one Spirit, into one Body; not
the washing away the filth of the flesh, but
[Page 17]the answer of a good conscience towards God by the resurrection of Jesus Christ;
Acts 1.5. without which, no other Baptism can save us,
Gal. 3.27. they being but figures or shadows; but this Baptism of Christ is the substance, whereby we are Baptized into his death; and
those that are baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
4. Concerning the Lords Supper:
Matth. 26.26, 28. Joh. 6.51, 53, 54, 55, 56. 1 Cor. 11.24, 25. Col. 2.10. The true Supper of the
Lord is the Spiritual eating and drinking of the flesh and blood of Christ, Spiritually; which the Spiritual man only eateth, and is thereby nourished up unto eternal life: without which eating, there can be no life in the creature, profess what you will; And all who eat of this bread, and drink of this cup, have real communion in Christ the head, and also one with another, as members; and are of one heart, and one minde, a compleat body in Christ. Now the world, who take only the outward signes,
1 Cor. 11.27, 28, 29. and are not brought in
discerning of the Lords body, eat and drink damnation to themselves, and become
guilty of the body and blood of Christ; and calls this a Communion, but lives in envy, strife, and debate, fighting, and going to Law one with another, for earthly things.
5. Concerning the Resurrection:
Joh. 5.29. That all shall arise to give an account and
receive at the last day
according to their works,
1 Cor. 15.38. 1 Cor. 15.42, 43, 44.
whether good or evil. These bodies that are dust, shall turn to dust,
but God shall give a body as pleaseth him; that which is sown in corruption, shall be raised in incorruption; it is sown a natural body, it is raised a spiritual body;
Phillip. 3.21. Rev. 2.6.
and as we have born the Image of the earthly, so we shall bear the Image of the heavenly: but
flesh and blood cannot inherit the Kingdom of heaven; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption; for we must be
changed.
1 Cor. 15.20. But they who cannot witness the first Resurrection within themselves, know nothing of the second, but by hear-say; and therefore, say some of your Teachers, that Christ is in Heaven with a carnal body. Now that Christ,
1 Cor. 15.47. who is the first fruits, should be in Heaven with a carnal body, and the Saints with a spiritual body, is not proportionable.
6. Concerning Magistracy: It is an Ordinance of God, Ordained
for the punishment of evil doers, and an incouragement for them that do well; Where Justice and Righteousness is the
[Page 18]head, and ruleth without partiality, that Land is kept in peace; and those that judge for the Lord, I honor as my own life, not with a flattering honor, putting off the hat and bowing of the knee, which is the honor of the world
having mens persons in admiration because of advantage for self ends;
Jude 16. but from my heart, for conscience sake, as to the power which is of God, and not to mens persons; for the Scripture saith, he that respects persons, commits sin,
Jam. 2.9. Jam. 2.1, 2, 3, 4. and is convinced of the Law, as a transgressor; and the Apostle
Iames commands the Saints
not to have the faith of our Lord Jesus Christ the Lord of glory, with respect of persons; for saith he
such are partial in themselves, and become Judges of evil thoughts.
Rom. 13.1, 2. And saith
Paul, Let every soul be subject to the higher power; for, saith he
there is no power but of God: the powers that be, are ordained of God; and that
whosoever resisteth the power, resisteth the Ordinance of God: and saith,
We must needs be subject,
Rom. 13.5.
for Conscience sake: and therefore, though the Prophets were often sent by the Lord, to pronounce Judgment against unjust men, who had the power committed to them and did not judg for God,
Hosea 5.12 but for self-ends; yet they never attempted any violence against them but used all means to perswade them to
love mercy,
Mica. 6.8.
do justice, & walk humbly with God, that they might be established and the wrath of God turned from them; for those that be of God, cannot rejoyce in the sufferings of any, but would have all to turne, and finde mercy.
7. Concerning the Ministery: The true Ministery of Jesus Christ have always been,
2 Pet. 1.21 Eph. 4.7.8, 11. and are still, such as come not by the will of man, but by the will of God; neither are they fitted for the work, by any thing of man, but by God alone: for the true Ministery is the gift of Jesus Christ, and needs no addition of humane help and learning;
1 Cor. 12.7. 1 Pet. 4.10, 11. but as the work is spiritual, and of the Lord; so they are spiritually fitted only by the Lord, and therefore he chused Herds-men. Fisher-men, and Plow-men, and suchlike; and as he gave them an immediate call, without the leave of man; so he fitted them immediately, without the help of man; and as they
received the gift freely,
Matth. 10.8. so they were to
give freely; And whenever they found any of the false Ministery, that taught for hire, they cryed out against them, and pronounced woes against
[Page 19]them, and shewed them that they
lay in iniquity,
Act. 8.20 Joh. 10.13 Mic. 3.10.
because they thought that the gift of God could be bought and sold for money: and Christ calls them
hirelings, and saith they
care not for the sheep:
Jer. 5.30, 31. Jer. 6.13. and
Micah cryes out against the Priests that taught
for hire; and (saith he)
they build up Sion with blood, and Jerusalem with iniquity: and
Jeremiah cryed out against the Priests in his dayes, that
bare rule by their means and calls it
a horrible thing; and saith, that
from the least of them to the greatest: they are all given to covetousness:
Isa. 56.10, 11. And
Isaiah cryes out against those in his dayes, and calls them
greedy Dogs, that can never have enough; and saith he
they all look for their gain from their quarter. And
Peter saith of such as should come,
2 Pet. 2.3. that they
through covetousness should make merchandise of the people;
2 Pet. 2.14, 15. and saith they have hearts exercised with covetous practises, who
have forsaken the right way, and have followed the way of Balaam,
who loved the wages of unrighteousness:
2 Cor. 11 15. And
Iude cryes
Wo unto them, for they go on in the way of Cain in his murder,
Jude 11. and
run greedily after the error of Balaam
for reward. But those that were sent out by Christ,
1 Cor. 9.16, 17, 18 counted it their gain to
make the Gospel without charge; neither eve
[...] had they any set means, but went about, having no certain dwelling place; never were masters, but
servants to all for Christs sake;
1 Cor. 4. ii. nor ever went to Law for Tythes, or any other carthly thing.
Now all people, try your Priests by the Scriptures,
1 Joh. 2.3, 4, 5, 6. 2 Joh. 9.11 whether they be of God, or of the world; and never think to hear the Word of the Lord from their mouths, who walk contrary to the Scriptures; for such were never sent of God: for had they been sent of God, they would abide in his doctrine:
2 John. 9.10, 11. and saith
Iohn Such
have not God: but he that abideth in the Doctrine of Christ, hath both the Father and the Son.
And if there come any to you, and bring not this Doctrine, you are
forbidden to receive them into your house, or bid them God-speed: for if you do, you are partakers of their evil deeds.
And unto the wicked saith God, What hast thou to do to declare my Statutes,
Psal. 50.16, 17.
or that thou shouldest take my Covenant into thy mouth? seeing thou hatest instruction, and castest my words behinde thy back and art a partaker with the Thief, the Adulterer Evil-speaking,
Psal. 50.21. Slandering, and Deceit; and such as these,
think God to be like themselvs.
Divers particulars of the persecutions of
James Nayler, by the Priests of
Westmerland.
I
Ames being at a meeting at
Edward Briggs house on the first day where many people met, he was desired by divers friends to meet the day following at Widow
Cocks house, about a mile from
Kendal; whereof the Priests having notice, raised the Town of
Kendal against him; but being long in gathering together, the meeting was done; but spies being out upon the Steeple top, and other places, notice was given what way
James passed from thence: and coming down towards
Kendal, two Priests, being accompanied with a Justice of peace, and some other Magistrates of the Town, with an exceeding great multitude of people following them, met him, saying,
Nayler, I have a message from the Lord Jesus Christ to thee, but that there is not a convenient place. To which
James answered,
The Lord Jesus Christ is no respecter of places. The message that he had to declare, was this:
I conjure thee that thou tell me, by what power thou inflictest such punishment upon the bodies of creatures. James answered,
Dost thou remember who it was that did adjure Christ to tell if he were the Son of God and asked by what Authority he did those things? for
James saw him to be one of that Generation. But the Priest still conjuring him to tell by what power he did it;
James answered,
Dost thou acknowledge it to be done by a power? Yea (saith he)
I have the Spirit of God, and thereby I know it is done by a power. James said,
If thou have the Spirit of God, as thou sayest thou hast, then thou canst tell by what power it is done. The Priest said,
When God
[Page 21]comes, he comes to torment the souls and not the bodies. Iames said,
He comes to redeem the souls.
But after much jangling, the Priest began to accuse him before the Justice and Magistrates, of many things; As,
that he taught people to burn their Bibles, Children to disobey their Parents, Wives their Husbands, People to disobey the Magistrates and such-like accusations: To which
James answered,
Thou art a false accuser: prove one of these things if thou canst, here, before the Magistrates. But not being able to prove any one, he began to accuse
James for holding out a light that doth convince of sin,
which, saith the Priest,
all have not. To which
James said,
Put out one in all this great multitude that dare say he hath it not. Saith the Priest,
These are all Christians; but if a Turk or Indian were here, he would deny it. Iames said,
Thou goest far for a proof: but if a Turk were here he would witness against thee.
The people beginning to fight, the Priest turned away, saying,
Here will be a disturbance. Said
Iames. These are thy Christians, and this is the fruits of thy Ministery. But the Justice, with some others, did endeavour to keep the rude people off him, so that they could not come to their purpose there: But he being to pass over the Bridge, and through the Town, they that were of the Priests party ran before, swearing they would throw him off the Bridge into the Water; but coming thither, and seeing their purpose, he was encouraged in his God, who gave him assurance of protection, and did wonderfully keep him, and those that were with him: for when he came unto the Bridge, the word of the Lord came unto him, and he was made to cry out against their rage; and the power of the Lord was with him, so that he rereceived no harm, though he was made to speak all along, and in the Market-place, and till he came out of the Town. But the raging Priests continued shouting, crying, and throwing stones at him, a quarter of a mile out of the Town: But such was the power of the Lord, that neither he, nor any with him, received any harm. The work was wonderful, and we were brought much to admire it, and praise the Lord, who is blessed for ever and ever.
Another time,
Iames being desired of many Christian Freinds to be at a meeting at
Orton, there to wait upon the Lord for what he would make known to his people, did accordingly; and many friends and brethren accompanied him; but the Priests having intelligence some daies before, five of them were gathered together, and many people from all quarters. A friend in the Town desired
James to come to his house; and being come into his house, a message was sent from the Priests, desiring him to come into the Field, under pretence of a more convenient place for the great multitude. To which
Iames answered,
It is my desire that all may be edified: and coming into the field, the Priests came with a great multitude, and asked him by what authority he came thither, and had gathered together so many people to break the peace; and tempting him, said,
Wilt thou be bound that none here shall break the peace? To which
Iames answered,
We come not hither to create offences; but if any break the Law, let him suffer by the Law: for he perceived they intended violence, as it appeared afterwards.
But seeing they could not prevail in that, another of them desired him to go into the Church, as he called it, tempted him, saying,
The people may all sit and hear better: But
Iames perceiving their deceit, said,
All places were alike to him; he would abide in the field. Whereupon, they pulled out an Ordinance of Parliament, forbidding any to speak, but such as were authorized to speak either in Church, or Chappel, or any publick place; and bad him speak at his peril, as he would answer the contempt of it. To which he answered saying.
This is not a publick place. No? said one of the Priests,
Is not this a publick place, the Town-field? and charged the Constable of the town to do his office; and examined his authority:
James answered,
Those that are sent to declare the things of God, have not their authority from men. But they bad him prove that. He said,
Paul received not his commission from man nor by man. To which one of them answered,
That was his Gospel; but they would prove that Paul
had a call from man to preach; and for that end he named that place in
Acts 13.2. where the Holy Ghost said,
Separate me Barnab as and Saul: and the Apostles laid their hands upon
[Page 23]them; which, said one of them,
was the laying on of hands of the Presbytery; But when he had found that place,
Iames asked him if that was
Pauls call to the Ministery (three times) but he answered nothing. Then said
James, If that was his call he had preached long without a call before that; and instanced to prove it,
Gal. 1.
Whereupon that business ended; But another Priest stood up, and said,
Thou oughtest to give an account of thy faith to every one that asketh; whereupon, he asked divers questions; whereunto
Iames answered, insomuch that some who stood by, cryed out,
Answer not all but aske him some. A while after,
James asked him
how he would prove himself a Minister of the Gospel, and live upon Tythes? To which he would not answer. Then said
James, Neither will I answer thee, if thou ask me twenty more.
The next question he asked, was,
Whether Christ was ascended, or no: but
James said,
I will not answer thee. Whereupon, he cryed out to the people, and said,
He denies the humanity of Christ; and made a great outcry among the people of it. But the people cryed out, saying,
Let us hear him; you have often told us many things against him; let him speak, and then if he speak not truth, you may then reprove him. James hearing the desire of the people, began to speak; and the people gave audience and were very silent. But beginning to hold out Christ a lone to be the Teacher of his people inspirit and truth, one of the Priests cryed out,
I cannot endure to hear this Seducer any longer. Upon which.
Iames said,
Prove me a Seducer before all this people, or else thou art a false Accuser. But he had not one word to say against any thing that he had spoken; But said,
If thou wilt not answer me that Question I asked thee, I will call thee a Seducer as long as I live.
Whereupon, seeing there could be no peace there, nor liberty to speak, they desired
Iames to go into the house; and they kept close about him, to keep him from the violence of some that came along with the Priest: but they raged so, that he and some other friends received stripes, and with much ado got into the house; But the raging
Sodomites waited about the dore to do mischiefe,
[Page 24]and kept shouting about the house, all the while he was speaking; but the house being filled with People, they could not come to their purpose; and the Lord so ordered it in the Evening, we came away without any more harm: but not long after, there came some of the Priests party about the house and asked if
Nayler was gone: and when they heard he was gone, they said,
He may thank God of that. Thus by the wisdom of God he escaped their violence at that time.
But the Priests missing of their purpose there, the next first day after, they prepared their Sermons sutable to what they intended, possessing the people that he was a Blasphemer, and denyed the Resurrection, and the Humanity of Christ, and all Authority; and that the Parliament had opened a gap for Blasphemy, and, as it was said by some of their heaters, they did God good service that would knock him down. Thus having stirred up the ruder sort, the next day they prevailed with one called a Justice of Peace; the Priest's son got him to come twelve miles from his owne house; he was one that had been in actual arms against the Parliament, for the bringing in of the
Scots; And having armed a great multitude against the next morning, they came very early to the house where he was; where many Christian friends should have met that day, and asked for
Nayler threatning to knock out his brains against the stones in the wall, and that they would pull down the house, if he would not come out; though the dore was never shut against them. But some of them came into the house, and commanded him to come forth, under pretence to dispute with the Priest. But
Iames seeing what they intended, answered,
You did not use me so civilly the last time I was amongst you; but if any have a minde, they may come in, the dores are open. Which answer they told the Priests; whereupon, they rushed violently in, and took him by the throat, haled him out of the dore, into a field, where was a man whom they called a Justice, and with a Pitchfork struck off his Hat, and commanded him to answer to such Questions as the Priests would ask him. Whereupon, the Priest began to ask many Questions; as, concerning the Resurrection, the Humanity of Christ, the Scriptures; and divers other Questions, as the Sacrament, and such-like: to which he answered,
[Page 25]and proved Scripture. But at last, being asked if Christ was in him, he said
he witnessed him in measure. The Priest asked,
if Christ was in him as man. Iames said,
Christ is not divided. But he urged him to tell whether Christ as man was in him or no. He answered,
Christ is not divided; for if he be, he is no more Christ: but I witness that Christ in me who is God and man▪ in measure. But the Priest said,
Christ is in heaven with a carnal body. To which said
Iames, Christ filleth Heaven and Earth, and is not carnal, but spiritual: for if Christ be in heaven with a carnal body, and the Saints with a spiritual body, that is not proportionable; neither was that a carnal body which came in among the Disciples, the doors being shut: for Christ is a Mystery, and thou knowest him not.
Then after much jangling and tempting, the Priest not having got the advantage he waited for, he cried out unto the people not to receive him into their houses; and alledged that in the second Epistle of
Iohn, verse 10. Now how suitable that place was for his purpose, all people may see, who have eyes; for there they are forbidden to receive any into their houses but such who
abide in the Doctrine of Christ, and
confess themselves that they had both the Father and the Son, and preach that Doctrine: but the Priests say that is blasphemy.
Then the Priest turned away from him; upon which, the armed Multitude began to be violent against divers friends that were there.
Iames hearing friends cry out, said to the Justice,
You will surely set us peaceably into the house again: But seeing him to go away, and leave them in the hands of the rude multitude, he gave himself up, saying,
The will of the LORD be done.
Upon which, the Justice turned again, saying,
We will see him in the house again; and going towards the house, many friends kept close about
James, exposing their own bodies to the danger of their weapons, to save him harmeless; and so with much ado we got into the house, not receiving much harme. Which being done, and as
James was praising the Lord for his wondrous deliverance from their malicious intents, some heard them say,
If we let him go thus, all people will run after him. Whereupon,
[Page 26]they agreed that he should be brought before the Justice again; and came with violence, and haled him out again. Then the Justice and the Priest getting a horseback, they caused him to run after them to an Alehouse on the other side the water, where they went in, not suffering one friend to go in with
James. And when he came before the Justice, he told him, if he would not put off his hat, he would send him to prison, and also because he Thoued him; for the Justice said,
My Commission runs Yee. To which
James answered,
I do it not in contempt; for I own Authority, and honour it according to the Scriptures; But I finde none such honour commanded in Scripture, but forbidden. Then they concluded to commit him for that, and also as a wandring person, and said none there knew from whence he came; for those who knew him were kept out. Then said he to
Arthur Scaife, Thou knowest me; I was in the Army with thee eight or nine yeers. It is no matter, said the Justice,
thou art no Souldier now.
Then they writ a
Mittimus to send him to prison; and carried him to
KirkbyS-teven that night, and shut him up in a Chamber, and set a guard upon him; but divers of our friends following into the Town, where a great multitude was gathered together for meeting, then did the people come from the Steeple-house, where another had been preaching; for divers of the Priests were gathered together that day; some preaching, some plotting, and some persecuting:
Iezabel's fast was a preparation for
Naboths death. But friends not being suffered to go into the house where
Iames was, they abode in the streets; and some of them being moved to speak to the people, the Priests perceiving the people to give audience to what was spoken, made complaint: Whereupon, some were sent forth, and with violence fetched in one
Francis Howgill, a friend; who was speaking to the people, and brought him into the high-Priests hall, where were five Priests assembled, with many other of their party, but not one friend. And bringing him before the Justice he was commanded to put off his hat. He answered,
I know no such law. The Priest said,
He will tread both Ministery and Magistracy under his feet. He said,
Thou art a false Accuser; prove wherein. But one that stood by,
[Page 27]took off his hat, and cast it into the fire. Then said the Justice
What is this thou speakest against the Ministers? He answered,
What hast thou to accuse me of? Whereupon, one affirmed that he said.
All the Ministers that taught for hire, and in Steeple-houses, were enemies, and Lyars against Jesus Christ, and no Ministers of Iesus Christ. Upon that, the Justice said,
Thou speakest against the Law; for the Law gives them their maintenance. He said,
I meddle not of the Law but of their practice. Then said
Francis to the Priest
Didst thou ever know a Minister of Jesus Christ that was a persecuter, or did labour to imprison any? And after some more discourse, he said to the Priest,
I have seen a great deal of tyranny and persecution in this dayes actions. Then said the Justice to the people,
Take notice, he saith the Law I act by is Tyranny and persecution. To which the people assented. Then said
Francis. Thou maist give out to the people what thou wilt; but I speak not of the law but of your Actions. Upon that, he was sent to prison; a guard of eight men was set over them who spent the night in drinking swearing, and filthy and unclean talking; and the more they were desired by the people to take heed of sin, the more filthy they did appear: but these are the fittest instruments for acting the Priests intentions, being Members of their Churches.
The next day they were guarded to
Appleby: but some friends following could not be suffered to pass on the streets that way, so great was their envy against all that set their face that way. And the Prisoners being brought thither, much meanes was used that none should come at them, but such as were sent to tempt them. There they were kept untill the Sessions; in which time they sent up and down the Country to seek for any who would witness any thing against them, and improved their utmost interest for their advantage. A Jury was chosen; divers of them were resolved on the business, so that it was told the Prisoners what would become of them, before the day of examination came; and it was accordingly: For the day came, and judgement passed; but the Prisoners never saw their Accusers, nor know who they are; but against that day, the Priests had prepared three large Petitions stuft with most filthy untruths and slanders, raised out of the bottomless
[Page 28]pit; but not one of them proved though one of the Justices said to them,
It is fit they should be proved; neither was there any thing in them, which they could charge upon the Prisoners, save onely the power of the Lord had manifested at their meetings in shaking proud flesh, and pouring out his Spirit upon many, especially, as they said, upon little children; which the Priests concluded was Sorcery and Witchery, and of the Divel: hereby declaring themselves to be of that generation, who
called the good man of the house Beelzebub; and if they should not do the same to them of his houshold, the words of Christ could not be fulfilled.
Likewise they had gathered up all reports, true or false of things done by many that the Prisoners had not seen the faces of, nor ever knew; thinking thereby to make them odious to the people. They also brought two Priests out of
Lancashire, to swear things that another man had spoken in the presence of four Justices of the peace, and for which the man had been tryed and cleared: And these they brought, thinking to
add afflictions to the Prisoners bonds. But he is kept in great peace and joy, having not any comfort from man, but from God, who hath appeared to him in this condition, and hath given him assurance of his love, in whom he rests. To whom be praise, honour, and glory, for ever. Amen.
The Examination of
James Nayler, upon an Indictment of Blasphemy, at the Sessions at
Appleby, in
January 1652.
IƲstice Pearson.
Put off your Hats.
Iames.
I do it not in contempt of Authority: for I honour the power as it is of God, without respecting mens persons it being forbidden in Scripture. He that respects persons, commits sin, and is convinced of the Laws a Transgressor.
Just. Pear.
That is meant of respecting persons in judgment.
Iames.
If I see one in goodly apparel and a gold Ring and see one in poor and vile Raiment, and say to him in fine apparel, Sir thou in a higher place then the poor, I am partial, and judge of evil thoughts.
Col. Brigs.
If thou wert in the Parliament-house, wouldst thou keep it on?
Jam.
If God should keep me in the same minde I am in now, I should.
Col. Brigs.
I
knew thou wouldst contemn Authority.
Jam.
I speak in the presence of God, I do not contemn Authority; but I am subject to the power as it is of God, for Conscience sake.
Just. Pears.
Now Authority commands thee to put off thy Hat; what sayest thou to it?
James.
Where God commands one thing, and man another, I am to obey God rather then man.
Col. Benson.
See whether the Law commands it, or your owne wills.
[Page 30]
The Inditement was read, wherein
James was Indited for saying that
Christ was in him and that there was but one word of God.
Col. Brigs.
Where wast thou born?
James.
At
Ardislaw two miles from
Wakefeild.
Col. Brigs.
How long livedst thou there?
James.
Until I was married: then I went into
Wakefeild Parish.
Col. Brigs.
What Profession wast thou of?
James.
A Husbandman.
Col. Brigs.
Wast thou a Souldier?
Jam.
Yea; I was a Souldier betwixt eight and nine years.
Col. Brigs.
Wast thou not at Burford among the Levellers?
Jam.
I was never there.
Col. Brigs.
I
charge thee by the Lord, that thou tell me whether thou wast or no.
Jam.
I was then in the North, and was never taxed for any Mutiny, or any other thing, while I served the Parliament.
Col. Brigs.
What was the cause of thy coming into these parts?
James.
If I may have liberty, I shall declare it. I was at the plow, meditating on the things of God, and suddenly I heard a voice, saying unto me,
Get thee out from thy Kindred and from thy Fathers house: and I had a promise given in with it. Whereupon, I did exceedingly rejoyce, that I had heard the voyce of that God which I had professed from a Child, but had never known him.
Col. Brigs.
Didst thou hear that voice?
Jam.
Yea, I did hear it; and when I came at home. I gave up my Estate, cast out my mony; but not being obedient in going forth, the wrath of God was upon me so that I was made a wonder to all; and none thought I would have lived; but (after I was made willing) I began to make some preparation; as apparel, and other necessaries, not knowing whither I should go. But shortly afterward going agateward with a friend from my owne
[Page 31]house, having on an old Suit, without any money, having neither taken leave of wife or children, not thinking then of any journey, I was commanded to go into the West, not knowing whither I should go, nor what I was to do there: but when I had been there a little while, I had given me what I was to declare; and ever since I have remained, not knowing to day what I was to do to morrow.
Col.
Brigs.
What was the Promise thou had'st given?
Iames.
That God would be with me: which promise I finde made good every day;
Col. Brigs.
I never heard such a call as this is, in our time?
James.
I believe thee.
Just.
Pears.
Is Christ in thee?
James.
I witness him in me: and if I should deny him before men, he would deny me before my Father which is in heaven.
Just.
Pears.
Spiritual, you mean.
Iam.
Yea, Spiritual.
Just.
Pears.
By faith, or how?
Jam.
By Faith.
Just.
Pears.
What difference then between the Ministers and you?
Jam.
The Ministers affirm Christ to be in heaven with a Carnal body, but I with a Spiritual body.
Just.
Pears.
Which of the Ministers say Christ is in heaven with a Carnal body?
Iam.
The Minister so called of
Kirkby-Steven.
Priest
Higginson stood up, and affirmed it again openly before all the Court.
Iames.
If Christ be in heaven with a Carnal body, and the Saints with a Spiritual body, it is not proportionable; neither was that a carnal body which appeared among the Disciples, the doors being shut, and appeared in divers shapes.
Quest.
Was Christ man, or no?
Iames.
Yea, he was, and
took upon him the seed of Abraham and was real flesh and bone; but is a Mystery not known to the carnal man; for he is begotten of the
immortal seed, and
[Page 32]those that know him know him to be Spiritual; for it was
the Word that
became flesh and dwelt amongst us; and if he had not been Spiritual he had not wrought my Redemption.
Just.
Pears.
Is Christ in thee as man?
Iames.
Christ filleth all places, and is not divided: separate God and man and he is no more Christ.
Just.
Pears.
If we stand to dispute these things, we should have the Ministers.
James
Perceiving Priest
Higginson offended, because he had told of his saying that Christ was in heaven with a carnal body,
James said,
Friend I had not accused thee, had I not been asked what was the difference between the Ministers and me: for I am not come to accuse any; for I am against accusations.
Col. Brigs.
Wast thou not of a Kirk about Sawrby?
James.
I was a member of an Independant Church at
Weedchurch.
Col. Brigs.
Wast thou not excommunicated for thy blasphemous Opinions?
James.
I know not what they have done since I came forth; but before I was not, to my knowledge.
Col.
Brigs called of Mr.
Coale, saying,
Did you ere hear such a call as this? did you hear it?
Coale.
Yea, I heard part of it.
Col. Brigs.
Didst not thou write a paper wherein was mentioned, that if thou thinkest to be saved by that Christ which dyed at Jerusalem, thou art deceived?
James.
If I cannot witness Christ nearer then
Jerusalem, I shall have no benefit by him; but I owne no other Christ but that who
witnessed a good confession before Pontius Pilate; which Christ I witness suffering in me now.
Col. Brigs.
Wilt thou deny thy hand?
James.
I will not deny my hand, if I may see it; and I desire that I may have so much favour, that that paper may be kept as an evidence either with or against me.
A large Petition being read, wherein was something against quaking and trembling.
[Page 33]
Just. Pears.
How comes it to pass that people quaks and tremble?
James.
The Scriptures witness the same condition in the Saints formerly; as
David Daniel, Habakkuk, and divers others.
Just. Pears.
Did they fall down?
James.
Yea some of them did so.
Coale.
David
said all his bones were broken, but they were whole.
James.
So are these now.
Coal.
Moses trembled; for he saw the face of God, and all Israel.
James.
Did all
Israel see the face of God? that crosseth the Scriptures.
Coale.
They saw his glory. I
shall see the Lord with these eyes; putting his fingers to his eyes.
James.
They must first be made spiritual: he cannot be seen with carnal eyes, for he is a Spirit; and no flesh can see God, and live.
Coale.
That light by which I
am justified, is a created light.
James.
That light by which I am justified, is not a created light.
Coale.
That is true.
Just.
Pears.
To the Word: What say'st thou to the Scriptures? are they the Word of God?
Jam.
They are a true Declaration of the Word that was in them who spoke them forth.
Higginson.
Is there not a written Word?
Jam.
Where readest thou in thy Scriptures, of a written word? The word is spiritual, not seen with carnal eyes: but as for the Scriptures, they are true, and I witness them true, in measure fulfilled in me, as far as I am grown up.
Just.
Pears.
Why dost thou disturb the Ministers in their publick worships?
Jam.
I have not disturbed them in their publick worships.
Just.
Pears.
Why dost thou speak against Tythes, which are allowed by the States?
[Page 34]
Iam.
I meddle not with the States; I speak against them that are hirelings, as they are hirelings: those that were sent of Christ, never took Tythes, nor ever sued any for wages.
Just.
Pears.
Dost thou think we are so beggerly as the Heathens, that we cannot afford our Ministers maintenance? We give them it freely.
Iam.
They are the Ministers of Christ, who abide in the doctrine of Christ.
Just.
Pears.
But who shall judg? how shall we know them?
Jam.
By their fruits you shall know them; they that abide not in the Doctrine of Christ, make it appear they are not the Ministers of Christ.
Just.
Pears.
That is true.
Accusations against
Jo: Lawson, by him answered.
THat
Joh: Lawson of
Lancaster, did affirme,
December the fourth, 1652.
Object.
That he was dead, and rose againe.
Answ. Thou art a witness against him that is risen risen from the dead, whereof the Apostles were witnesses. Here thou shewest thy self to be a witness against the living, and shewest thy self to be in the death, and no Minister of Christ: for the Ministers of Christ justified them which were raised from the dead:
Eph. 2.1.
Even when we were dead in trespasses and sins hath he quickned us together with Christ, and hath raised us together, and hath made us to sit in heavenly places in Christ Jesus.
Rom. 6.10, 11.
Likewise reckon you also your selves to be dead indeed unto sin but alive unto God, through Jesus Christ: for in that he died, he died once unto sin; in that he lives, he lives unto God. Here thou shewest thy self to be no Minister of Jesus Christ. He that believeth, hath
passed from death to life, because be loveth his brethren: here thou shewest thou dost not believe, but art in the death, and art in envy; so thou shewest forth thy self to be
Cain, and hatest thy brethren.
We know that we are translated from death unto life, because we love our brethren: he that loveth not his brother, abideth in the death; and there thou art.
Whosoever hateth his brother, is a man-slayer; and you know that no man-slayer hath eternal life abiding in him, 1
Joh. 3. And this is thy condition, and here thou art an Antichrist in the world, envying those who are raised from the dead; and thou seekest to bring them to the death, whom God hath raised from
[Page 36]the death. Thou hast not seen thy self to be the prodigal; yet the Scripture saith,
Luk. 15.24
This my son was dead, and is alive againe: but thou art
without God in the world.
Object. 2.
That the day of judgement was past.
Answ.
Mat. 12.20 Christ speaks,
The bruised reed he will not break, the smoaking Flax he will not quench, till he bring forth judgement into victory. Here thou shewest thy self to be ignorant of the Scripture; but onely as a hear-sayer thou speakest, and the outside of the Letter, and not Christ; and canst not witness him, who brings forth judgement into victory, but standest as a witness against them who witness the Scriptures fulfilled in them, and Christ bringing forth judgement into victory: and here thou shewest thy self to be unacquainted with Christ, and thy nakedness and ignorance thou makest appear.
Object. 3.
That he had been in Hell, and is now in Heaven.
Answ. Here thou shewest thy self to be a witness against the holy men of God. Jonah saith,
Out of the belly of hell cryed I,
Jon. 2.
and thou heardest my voice, and the Lord delivered him out of hell; and might not he confess it? (thou hypocrite.)
For thou wilt not leave my soul in hell, neither wilt thou suffer thy holy one to see corruption.
Psa. 16.10.
Thou hast delivered my soul out of death: bless the Lord, my soul,
and all that is within me, bless his holy name.
Psa. 103.1.2. How darest thou profess the Scriptures, and the holy men of Gods-conditions, which were raised and brought out of death; and if any witness the holy men of Gods condition, thou persecutest them? O thou blind hypocrite! here thou shewest thou never sawest hells mouth yet, therefore thou never cryedst in hell yet.
Object. 4.
That he was come to the infinite company of the first-born, and the Spirits of just men made perfect.
Answ. Paul said (who was a Minister of God)
But ye are come to Mount Sion,
Heb. 12.22
and unto the City of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem,
and to an innummerable company of Angels, to the general Assembly and Church of the first-born which are written in heaven; unto God the judge of all, and
[Page 37]to the spirits of just men made perfect. Paul was
A Minister of Jesus Christ by the will of God, who incouraged the Saints who were brought hither; but thou now persecutest them, and art a witness against them that confess they are brought hither: here thou shewest thou hast the spirit of errour, openly; and art no Minister of God, no not of the Letter; but art against the Letter as it speakes, persecuting them that have the life of it.
Object. 5.
That he had heard the last Trumpet sound, and seen the new Jerusalem.
Answ. Here thou shewest forth thy spite and venome: If
John was here, which
saw the great City and holy Ierusalem descend out of heaven from good (John said,
I saw the holy City New Ierusalem come down from God out of heaven) thou wouldst be a witness against him; & thou shewest thyself in the generation that was ever persecutors slanderers, & opposers of the power of truth. Where the same spirit is that was in
Iohn. he sees these things now, as he did then: but where the same spirit is not, which thou shewest thou hast not, but a contrary spirit that persecutes them which do see those things; but is as a dog to bite and devour,
Iohn saw the last trumpet sound, which shews thou art not come to the first.
Blow the trumpet in Slon,
Joel 2.1.
sound an alarm in my holy mountain; let all the inhabitants of the earth tremble. Here be thou a witness against thy self, that thou art a witness against the truth, and in the generation of them that ever slew the righteous seed.
Obj. 6.
That John Lawson
said he had seen God face to face.
Answ. Here thou shewest thy self to be a witness against them that know God, and makest thy self manifest to be a heathen: for all are heathens that do not know God; and no man knoweth God saving he that is born of God; and who are born of God, are owners of the truth, and not against it, but against the deceit.
Jacob said,
I have seen God face to face.
Gen. 32. Isa. 6.5. Job 42.5.
Isaiah said,
Mine eyes have seen the King, the Lord of hosts. Job said, I
have heard of thee by the hearing of the ear; but now mine eyes have seen thee.
Exo. 33.11. And God spake to
Moses face to face. Here you may take your oaths, and swear against
Jacob, against
Isaiah, against
Job, and against
Moses. Where the
[Page 38]same Spirit is made manifest; and who are born of God, know God face to face, as they did: but they who are born of the flesh, persecute them who are born of the Spirit; and there you shew your selves to be, taking oaths and swearing against them that know God, seeking to bring them to prison or bondage: for you never read in all the Scriptures, that the Prophets or the Apostles took their oaths against any which confessed they had seen God, or put up a Petition to the Magistrates, or witnessed it with oathes against any of them: the Ministers of God said,
Swear not at all. And here you shew your selves to be no Ministers or friends of God, but without God; for the Ministers of God are to bring people to know God, and to the Church in God, and to the heavenly Jerusalem, and to the innummerable company of Angels, and minister to that which is in prison, and in death; but if any come to witness these things fulfilled, you are witnesses against them with Oaths, and would bring the bodies of such into prison, where the seed of God is raised out of prison within; shewing your selves to be Antichrists, persecuters of the power of truth, and beasts which shall make war against the Saints, and against the Lambe: but the Lamb shall get the victory.
Job cryed when the Lord hid his face; and
David cried when the Lord hid his face, and said,
O Lord, I
will seek thy face. And here you shew, you neither know his face, nor have seen it; but are persecuters of them who know it and seek it.
Praises, praises be to the Lord for ever.
FINIS.