Answer.

1. You begin with a false recital, either of the Text, or of the words of the Petition, which ever it is that you in­tend: for the words, That they be not tossed about with every wind of doctrine, do express that benefit to the Church which God intendeth in giving them a Ministry; but are not applyed in the Text directly to the Ministers, as such; (though a great­er favor to them is implyed.)

2. All the Ministers in England, whom that Petition doth mention, are given to the Church for the perfecting of the [Page 2] Saints, and the edifying of the Body of Christ. But it doth not follow, that the Ministers of this Age must therefore bring the Church or Saints to perfection: for the Apostle speaks here of Christs giving a Continuation of Ministers, from his Ascension till the Church or Body of Christ be perfected; and so he speaks not of the perfection of each particular mem­ber, as it is antecedent to the perfection of the whole Body: but he speaks of perfecting the whole Bodie, by gathering home every member that is yet to be gathered, and so per­fecting each member in the perfection of the whole. This work therefore of perfecting is neither to be done conclusive­ly by any one Age of Ministers before the last age; nor upon any one Beleever till that last Age come. If a Prince resolve to build a Citie, and having begun it in his life time, he leave in his Testament a provision of maintenance for such a num­ber of workmen as in three or four Ages shall perfect the Citie: I hope you can understand, that every workman is given for the perfecting of this work, both they that lay the Foundation, and they that build the Walls, and they that lay on the Roof; and yet, though all are given towards the perfecting of it, all do not actually perfect it: All work for the perfection of the Building; but it is he that layes on the top stone that perfecteth it: Yet the intire work when it is accomplished, shall be ascribed as well to the former Builders as the last, according to the proportion of their interest in the Work. God hath promised such a succession of Builders till his House be finished; and he will make good his promise in despight of all the rage of Hell.

3. Even particular Saints are led on by the guidance of the Ministry, till they come to perfection. Though they are not capable of perfection of degrees of holinesse or happinesse in this life; yet the Vessell which shall convey them to the Har­bour of perfection, is steered and governed by the Ministers of Christ, under him the chief Governor: And when they are landed, their souls are perfected, in comparison of what they are here: though the most full and absolute perfection be only at Christs second coming and our Resurrection, when soul and bodie shall be joyned in felicitie.

Answ.

1. Wee cheerfully accept of Christs wages, it being the meer fruit of his bounty, and but in a very low and dimi­nutive sense called wages: for we are so far from deserving it, that we deserve his wrath.

2. Our fullest wages (yet of free gift) is expected by us in the life to come: yet in this life he hath made us provision for our journey.

3. What you mean by [Christs agreeing with us for wages] I know not whether you understand your selves: Wee made no capitulations with him, but thankfully accept of what he hath offered: And so we be sure of that in the life to come, we refer the rest the more cheerfully to his pleasure: and of the former, it hath pleased him already to assure us, if wee continue faithfull and overcome.

But you must be pleased to be informed, that God gives us our wages (as you call it) two wayes.

First, He gives us Right to it: And then he gives the Thing it self.

The Right which he gives us is by two distinct means and steps: First, He hath made a Law, commanding all the world to whom we preach his Gospel, to allow us a sufficient main­tenance, that we may not be hindered from or in his Work: But whether he hath setled the punctual proportion of Tenths, is a Dispute that I will not trouble you with. Onely I will tell you, that the world hath not yet answered severall judi­cious Treatises that are written for it; and I do not expect you should answer them. It is enough for me, that Christ [Page 4] hath commanded that men muzzle not the Ox that treadeth out the Corn; and said, Who goeth to warfare at his own charge? They that minister about holy things, live of the things of the Temple; even so hath the Lord ordained, that they which preach the Gospel, should live of the Gospel, 1 Cor. 9. 7. to 15. And Christ himself sent out his Disciples to preach, without any provision of maintenance of their own, because, The Labourer is worthy of his hire: We de­serve it of men, though we deserve it not of God. Now if God have laid this command on men, no man can be said to be free to break it: Gods Lawes bind more then the Laws of men. 2. Yet because it is not Christs rule, that we should take it without mens giving, but that men should be his hand to reach it to us, therefore we have no actual immediate right to the individual Maintenance it self, till men obey Gods command by conferring it upon us. God hath made it every mans duty to do this freely of his own accord, so that he doth but Justice in doing it, and we are not beholden and indebted to him for it; (though to God we are.) And where any man will not do justice, and pay the Labourer the wages that he owes him, the Magistrate must see Justice done, or else I know not what he hath to do. I pray you tel me, if the Souldiers that you mention, that must be content with their wages, had been denied their wages by an infe­rior Clerk of a Company or Troop, had it been any sinful discontent to have complained to the Captain or Colonel? It seems by you, a man is not content with his wages, except he be content that men defraud him of it; nor content with the bountiful provision of Christ by his lawes, except he be content with the sinful refusal of men to obey those Lawes? I pray you hereafter distinguish a little better between dis­content with Christ, and with disobedient men; and between content with wages allotted by Christ, and content without it; and if you will add a third distinction, Between discon­tent, and the use of just means for relief. All this I have spoke only of Christs conferring our Right to our Mainte­nance.

Secondly, As for his Giving it us in actual possession: He [Page 5] hath done his part as he is Law-giver, by commanding o­thers to give it us; as a father that commandeth the elder brother to pay Legacies to the younger: But as the gracious Father of his chosen, and the disposer of all things, so he doth moreover, see that his Servants want nothing that is good for them, and hath promised that their wants shall turn to their good; he hath bid us be careful for nothing, but cast all our care upon him, who hath promised to care for us. And we find by experience, that he will not fail us or forsake us, and that it is blessed to trust in him; so that we are con­tent with our wages, in which sense soever you mean it, as al­lotted us by Christ. If you mean it of allotting us our right by his Lawes, commanding our hearers to allow us sufficient maintenance; we are well content with his constitution, though not with mens disobedience: If you mean it of his providence, we are content (I can speak for my self) with the portion allotted: I confess I never wanted, but I hope I have learned to want, as well as to abound, though not by much experience; yet was I glad within this dozen years, to preach the Gospel for little, and sometimes for nothing. I think the case of many of my brethren, is the same in this with mine; and he that searcheth my heart knoweth, that it was an earnest thirst to win souls to Christ, that drew me into the Ministry; and that in the course of it, I sought not Theirs but Them; and that I never took pleasure in any maintenance or worldly accommodation, if I saw not the work of the Spirit prosper on the souls of my people, and then I thought I was paid to the full. And let me tell you a word in your ear that may displease you; All those of your party which have a design to extirpate the Gospel, by the extirpa­tion of a judicious, faithful Ministry, and that by with­drawing their maintenance, will find your selves very much deceived: for if you do so far prevail, by Gods permission, (for the ungrateful slighting of the Gospel in this Land) as to take down the stablish'd maintenance of the Ministry, we are resolved to preach never a Sermon the less, but labour with our hands; yea, beg our bread, rather then give over the work of God, especially when by the invasion of Ignorance [Page 6] and Schisme, the Churches necessities are increased: I tell the Divel this too, if he do not know it, that he may know what success to expect of his present designs: And I hope all faithful Ministers do second me in these resolutions.

Answer.

By the phrase [letting out] if you mean not [committing it to their Ministerial oversight] you speak to no purpose: if you do so mean, then you know little of Gods word if you doubt of that, whether God hath ordained that Ministers should be Teachers, Overseers, Guiders of his Church, and Stewards of his houshold and mysteries? whom he hath com­manded the people to obey: See Heb. 13. 7, 17, 24. Act. 20. 28 29, 30. 1 Thes. 5. 12, 13. 2 Cor. 6. 2. 1 Cor. 4. 1, 2. 1 Tim. 3. 5. Read the words.

Answer.

1. Christs setting Ministers under him in his Church, is no resigning it to them: We are but Ushers, and Christ is the only Prophet and chief Master of the School.

2. Who put it into your heart to question, whether we should rule them at our own will? your Query intimates, as if we maintained or pleaded for such a power: and Gods Spirit is not the Author of lying and slandering; Ergo, you sure speak not by the Spirit. We openly profess, that we must rule our flocks according to the will and word of Christ; and that if we speak contrary to this, none ought to believe us; or command any thing contrary to this, none ought to obey us: but then they must prove it contrary, and not falsly say so, when we manifest that we speak the words of truth.

3. For [having all the profit] you speak carnally, as if you [Page 7] thought a maintenance for our bodies while we are doing Christs work, were [all the profit] that his flock yeilds; I doubt you would fain partake your selves more of such profits, that you speak so esteemingly of them. The profit of Christs flock is their own salvation, and (Metaphorically) Gods glory. Lest you should long too much for such profit, I'le tell you some of mine. If I would have addicted my self to secular imploy­ments, I might have lived possibly in Honour in Riches, and in health; for many are Colonels and men of great place in the world, that had not so fair opportunities of rising as I. Some that have preached in the same Pulpit with me, have cast off their black coats, and put on Scarlet, and are become men of great Wealth and Dignity. Law, or Physick, or Soul­diery would have afforded a man Honors and Riches: but what get I in the Ministry? I'll tell you but the truth; Con­stant Study, Preaching, and all other labours, hath utterly o­verthrown my health; and I know not one hard Student and painful Preacher of many, but is languishing or sickly; yet though I am day and night full of pain, study I must, preach I must, I must visit the sick, instruct the ignorant, resolve the doubting, comfort the dejected and disquieted soul, ad­monish the scandalous and relapsed: as far as I am able, these must be done, and very much more; besides defending the truth against all wrangling Seducers: and when all this is done, what is my profit? Many a time heretofore, have I had the people secretly and openly reviling, slandering and cursing me: if I do but gal a guilty conscience, I provoke their cruel ha­tred; much ado to bring a few sinners to the sense of sin, and the true knowledg of Christ, and when we think we have ac­complished it, how many of them fall back? if there do but any Seducer come in among them, what danger are they in of re­ceiving their Delusions, before the Truth can have time to take rooting in them? How easily are these tossed up and down as children, and carried to and fro with every wind of doctrine? and though it be not much that Seducers have suc­ceeded in my own Charge, yet it is so in many others, to the grief of all that know and love them: In a word, between the obstinateness of the ungodly, the ignorance of the weak, [Page 8] and the pride, self-conceitedness and unruliness of Professors the life of a Minister is so heavy a burden, and such a conti­nual grief, that I confess from my heart, I have been many a time haunted with Jonas's temptation, to over-run Gods work and to put it off, as Moses and Jeremy would have done: we have flesh and bloud as well as other men, for we are but men: and when in the time of temptation, I have hearkned to the flesh, this hath been the language of it, [Was not I born as free a man as others? why must I then be tied up to this despised, hated, weary work? why may not I take that course, where I may have a fuller maintenance without grudging, as other men have? but that I must live with the grievance and repinings of others, as if I took the bread from their mouthes! where all that I receive is thought too much, and all that I give too little; where more is expected to be given back then I receive! Why must I sit from mor­ning to night in consuming studies, or else be instructing and admonishing them that will hate me for it? why must I live in continual pain and languishing, when other mens labours tend to their health? I must be groaning in my own sorrowes, and weeping for the obstinacy and danger of others, when other men go pleasantly about their work: and when I have laboured for them night and day, the thanks I must expect is to be hated and scorned by the ungodly, to be tired with the great unteachableness of the ignorant, to be grieved with the pride, unruliness and passions of Professors, and by such as these Pamphleters, to be called Dog, and Divel, and Bloud-Hound, for taking but my own, which never was theirs nor their forefathers; and for contradicting the silliest Se­ducers, that speak the grossest falshoods in the name of Gods Spirit.] Such thoughts as these the flesh hath too oft sug­gested; so that I confess, had I but free liberty to lay by this Calling, which you so reproach, my flesh would take it for the happiest hour that ever I saw. But do I approve of this, or grudge at my Imployment, and the disposal of my God? No, I bless the Lord daily, that ever he called me to this blessed work! it is but my flesh that repineth at it, God hath paid me for all these sufferings a thousand fold: O the [Page 9] sweetness of sacred Studies and Contemplations! they are the Recreations of my Spirit, though a weariness to the Flesh! O the Consolations that I have in the very opening his Gospel Mysteries, and in revealing the Hopes of the Saints, and the unseen glory of the Life to come! O how the Lord doth sweetly revive my own Faith, and Love, and Desire, and Joy and Resolution, and all Graces, whilst he sets me on those thoughts in my Studies, and those perswasions in my Preach­ing, which tend to revive the Graces of my Hearers! O the sweet comfort that I have in the abundant success of my La­bors, in the Conversion and Confirmation of souls, and in the Mortification and Vivification of my godly Friends! for it is not all, that are the Discouragers before mentioned. Tru­ly Gods work is most precious wages! yea, even my suffer­ings for him, are the inlets of my Joy! and my constant ex­perience assureth me, that the dearer it costeth me to serve him, the more abundant will be the in-comes of my Peace! and that no man shall ever be a loser by him! I would not therefore change my life for any of the greatest Dignities on earth: I had rather thus serve in the Gospel, and at the Al­tar of my Lord, and be called Dog and Divel, so he will but go on to bless my Labors, then to be bowed to, and honour­ed by all the world, and to be swelled with Riches, Titles, and Vain-glory to the utmost Greatness that the world can afford: I am willing to wait on God in this Work, and think my lines and lot well fallen; I am contented to con­sume my body, to sacrifice my Reputation to his Service; and to spend all that I have, and to be spent my self for the sake of men, though the more I love, the less I may be belo­ved: can I win the love of some of them to God, it is a less matter whether they love me (if not loving men would but consist with loving God). I have spent all these words, only to this end, to let you see what that life is that you so envy at; and what that great profit is, that you think attends the Ministry: A Physician can get Three hundred Pounds, per­haps a thousand Pounds per annum; a Minister is reviled as a greedy Dog, meerly because he hath a mouth to eat. In so doing, what do you but rail at God, that he did not [Page 10] make these Ministers without mouthes, and backs and bel­lies, that he made them of flesh and bloud, and not Angels that might have lived without food or raiment! God will answer you by himself one day.

Answer.

1. Our hope is in the Hope of Israel, the Lord Jesus, for the invisible things of the Glory to come: Of this we have the more reason to be ready to give an account, because we know we must shortly stand at the Bar of our Lord, where the grounds of hope must be revealed, and where he that speaks by your tongues against our Hope now, will himself speak against it then; even the great Accuser of the brethren will do the same work that you are now doing, that is questi­on our hopes of life by Christ; I have therefore no more to say to this question now, but to tell you, This is not the Judgment day. If you say, We must be damned; and if we say, Through Christ we hope for life; neither of our say­ings will decide the case; but if you will do this work, you must meet us at Judgment, and there we must give in our an­swer, where we look to be assaulted by a more subtil enemy. It may be as the Saints being absolved, shall judg the world with Christ; so the wicked being condemned, shall accuse the Saints with Satan; but that I know not: only I know, that you shall be there accused your selves; and he that pro­voketh you now to question our hopes, will then question yours: And therefore I warn you, that you provide your own Defence, as well as your Accusation of us.

2. I have told you, we stand contentedly to Christs provisi­on, but do you deal with others as unreasonably as with us? If your servant ask his wages, will you say, he forsakes Christ, and takes the world for his Master? yet the Apostle saith, [Page 11] that in serving you, he serveth the Lord Christ, of whom he shall receive his reward; and commandeth him to do it as to the Lord, Col. 3. 22, 23, 24. yet you are commanded to give your servant that which is just and equal, knowing that you have a Master in heaven, Col. 4. 1. May not your servant here serve two Masters, and expect wages from both, as long as they be not two co-ordinate masters, which Christ speaks of, but one subordinate to the other? yet, be it known to you, that we take not the Congregation for our Masters: A Mini­ster is a servant for the Church, but not of the Church: He is Christs servant, and not mans, though yet he be a sub­ject in the Commonwealth. If your Creditor ask you for his Debts, will you tell him therefore that he doth not trust Christ, but forsake him, and take the world for his Master? It seems, if your Reason rule, we shall have a mad world.

Answer.

1. Is it the Spirit of God, that teacheth you, by way of Query, to publish a lie to the world, intimating that it was Ministers that petitioned, when no Ministers did subscribe it? no, nor did any Minister first move it; but one of the Gentlemen that presented it, who to my knowledge gets his Corn at so dear rates, that I know no man in England that had more reason to grudg at Tythes, proportionably to his E­state, then he.

2. Do we go about to get any new establishment by Law? or only desire that the Law may not be destroyed, that giveth us the same right in the Tenth, which you have in the Nine parts? Do you not deal by us, just as if you met a True man on the High-way, that had but three Shillings in his purse; you take away two of them, and when you are about taking away the third, he desires you would leave him that to supply his [Page 12] necessity: you call him Bloud-Hound, greedy Dog, and Divel, and all that's naught, and Religiously tell him, he is unlike Christ, that bid him suffer wrong, and if any man take his coat, give him his cloak also, and resist not evil, &c. So, much of the Churches necessary means is alienated already; (whose these were shall be known shortly, when God will convince the proudest and subtillest Disputers, that Sacriledg is a sin;) and now you would have Tithes, and all stablish'd Maintenance down too, and rail at us, as being unlike the Apostle, for contradicting you, and for saying, [We pray you Gentlemen, do not rob God and his Church; or if you will venture to be Thieves, because you shall not be judged till death, yet be merciful Theeves, and take not all. The Assize will come, for all your unbelief and confidence of e­scaping.]

3. Do not you condemn your self by the Text you cite, which declareth Paul's power to take maintenance of the Churches? and so the dueness of that maintenance by Christs ordination? If people will obey Christ, then they are bound to pay it.

4. As for Pauls example; I am resolved to follow it, as far as I am able: Preaching and studying hath brought me past working, through pain and languishing; but when ever I find that taking Tithes will hinder the Gospel, more then fur­ther it, I will take none; if I meet with such seduced souls, that think its only their Tithes that I preach for, I will so long forbear taking Tithes of them, as may be necessary to convince them of their Error, and to win them: But if it be not weakness, but malice, the case differs. Paul's example tells me, that I should forbear my own right, where the taking or exacting it, may hinder the Gospel, or the saving of a soul; This counsel I follow: I never yet had an angry word with, or from any one man about Tithes, or any Maintenance: But will this excuse them, that deny me my Right? you ought to follow this Rule as well as I; you are bound not to exact your Debts or other Rights; nor a Gentleman to ex­act his Rents, where it will hinder the Gospel, and the saving of souls; for the Gospel and mens souls are more worth then [Page 13] money: But must they therefore be called Bloud-Hounds and Divels, that would not have all Lawes repealed, which require men to pay their Debts and Rents? Ah, poor Eng­land, that is grown so Lunatick, as to be taken with such arguings!

Answer.

1. What you would conclude by your first question, I know not, unless this be it, That Christ being the substance of all good, we must therefore seek nothing but Christ. But why then do you eat and drink? are not you Christs servant, (or should be) as well as we? though in another place?

2. Kings, Masters, Husbands, Heads, might be said also to typifie Christ, the King, Master, Husband, Head of the Church: but it doth not follow, that there must be no more Kings, Masters, Husbands, or Heads; for the typify­ing use may cease, and yet the thing continue to divers uses; and so may Temples and other such things.

3. The Gospel of God and the Gospel of Jesus Christ, is all one: But Christ and his Gospel is no more all one, then the Parliament and their Lawes be all one. And if this be your judgment, as it seems, no wonder if you be no better friends to Ministers, when you believe not in Christ that send­eth them.

4. I have told you, we are well content with what Christ gives us. But you should have put the case right about mans giving.

Answ. This is but the same with the 7^th, and is there an­swered already. I never went to law with any man for Debt; nor required or took a Debt to the hindrance of the Gospel, and mens salvation: I had rather die then any should make this my glorying void, and make me a hinde­rance to mens salvation, for my Debts, or for Mony. Doth it therefore follow, That no Magistrate or Rulers must make Laws for every man to pay his Debts? Or that no man loves Christ better then money, that demandeth a Debt? Should Law-makers be guided by such brains as yours?

Ans. I wil answer you with another Quere or two. 1. Whe­ther you that live so remote, and know not the Petitioners, are a fit man (by way of quere) to acquaint the world with the qualitie of them? or should dare to pretend to such a thing? 2. Whether that spirit which you boast of, do teach you to know mens hearts? yea, the hearts of 6000 men, whom you never knew? 3. Whether it be indeed the Spirit of God by which you speak, when without any shame or conscience, before God and the world, you never stick to publish in print such notorious Lyes against so many [Page 15] thousand men (if your Quere intimate any affirmation)? The Spirit of God is not a lying Spirit, nor dictates slan­ders, and that so impudent, that the whole Country that shall but read your Book, do know them to be lies and slan­ders. 4. Whether such impudent Lyers are like to be Christs Prisoners (as you call your selves?) or to be fit men to reform the Churches, and discover the errours of Mini­sters, as you pretend? 5. Whether those in this Nation that are led about by such as you, are not unquestionably led by the Divel, the Father of Lies? Having put these questions to you, I answer further,

1. Enquire better hereafter whether the Gentlemen that presented the Petition were against the Parliament? One of them was Governour of Warwick Castle through all the first Warrs; the other is wel known in London, and to ma­ny of the Parliament, to be none of their adversaries. There is one Colonel and two Captains of the Army that were his houshold Servants. Enquire whether those of the Worce­ster-shire Committee that subscribed the Petition, were such as you describe them. Enquire whether the present Major of Worcester, and the Major of Evesham, and the Bailiffs and Justices of Bewdley, Kiderminster, and other places, that subscribed it, were enemies to the Parliament? or whether any of these were such friends to the Bishops? If you have no better informer, let me tell you, that it was the generalitie of the godly men who have been still for the Parliament, that subscribed this Petition; (though I would I could say, that every man were godly that did subscribe it:) And that it was not urged on any; nor so much as sent to one half of the County, or very neer: And that a great part of the County took only the hands of Housholders, and not Sons or Servants; else many thousand more hands might quickly have been got: and that the Gentlemen and most others that ever were of the Kings party, were either never asked to subscribe, or (those very few that were, of whom I hear but of one or two) did in modestie refuse, lest their names should raise a prejudice in any against the Petition. So far is it from being true, which you speak, of many of them [Page 16] now alive being the only promoters of this Petition. O where was shame, conscience, fear of God, or belief of any future judg­ment, when this was written! And let me tell you, those of us that have been most against Bishops, are not so far run out of our wits through opposition to them, as to e­quallize such as you with them. We think, that for such as you to reproach men for being for Bishops, is as if a com­mon Robber should reproach him that once in anger gave his neighbour a box on the ear. The fearful wickednesse, and dotage, and Apostacie which such as you have been lately gi­ven up to, I dare say, hath done more to confirm many in their Judgments for Episcopacie, and for the late King, and hath done more to disgrace the present Cause of the present Parliament, and to raise an odium through the sober part of the world, on the Armie; yea, and to cause many sober, godly men to repent at the heart, that they once so scorned or op­posed the motions for a godly, regulated, moderate Epis­copacy: I say, the Examples of such as you, have done more to this, then all the learned Disputings in the world was e­ver like to have done without it: Yea, you have given the Papists themselves such advantage, that they think they have the poor ignorant people at the advantage of the Welsh Dilemma, Chuse whether you will goe to Rome, or to Bedlam. Though I know God will shew the sober and humble a way to escape both.

Lastly, How could you without trembling and blushing, thus publish your intimation to the world, That it was the Bishops, and the Kings Clergy that these Petitioners intend, when the world may see, that they mention no mans name in the Petition? and for their qualitie and character, they petition for no man but onely Godly, Faithful, Able Mini­sters. Would you have the world believe, that none but the Kings party were such? Or if these Petitioners had meant the Kings party, what danger was in that, when they leave it to the Parliament to judg who are godly, faithful, and able, and who not? If the Parliament judg right, and mean well, our meaning can do no harm. I proclaim to you and the world, Let our Petition be granted according [Page 17] to the proper sense of those words [for a godly, able, faith­ful Ministry] and we will take it thankfully, and not say, that they cross'd our meaning. Yea, let me tell you, that I read a Paper delivered by several Justices of the Peace, and other Gentlemen to Colonel Bridges, wherein they desired [him and Mr. Tho. Foley to present their Petition to the Parliament; and if they had opportunity, to expresse to them, that they spoke not for any ignorant, unsufficient, scandalous Ministers, but earnestly desired the continuance of the Parliaments care for the casting out of all such.]

I hope by this time the world may see what Truth to expect from such Teachers as you; that dare speak thus so openly, where it is so easie to disprove you. And lest you should think I speak on as great uncertainties as you, know that I saw and perused all the Subscriptions that came from every Town, Village or person in the County, and therefore speak not on blind conjectures.

Answ.

I also demand, 1. Whether he that accuseth the hearts of 6000, or pretendeth to foreknow their actions for the future, do not arrogate to himself the prerogative of God?

2. Whether he that insinuateth such Accusations against six thousand persons (which are many of them Justices and Commissioners of the State) which makes them guilty of in­tentions of Treason, and so of death; be not liable to be questioned by a Magistrate, without violation of the just Libertie of tender Consciences?

3. And whether such accusations of the hearts of 6000 unknown persons, can come from a better cause then malice and hatred, excited by Heresie? And whether he that ha­teth his brother be not a Murderer? And we know that no murderer hath eternall life abiding in him, 1 Joh. 3. 15. And he that loveth not his brother, and yet saith he loveth God, is a Lyer.

But (passing your language of scorn and non-sense) I fur­ther answer you: I know none in England that have been closer tryed, whether they would raise a new War, then the Worcester-shire Petitioners: In the second War, many of them were the instruments of suppressing a dangerous Plot, and threatned eruption in these parts, by preventing the seisure on Dawley Castle in Shropshire, and other waies. And now at last, the King of Scots came among us with a great Army, and neglected no winning means to have drawn us in: Of which, if any one of us are guilty, the law is open, and our lives forfeit: Accuse us and spare not: the Act of Oblivion hath excepted that Warr; Offenders are at each Assize indicted and search'd after. With what face then can you accuse us (that have been tryed so lately) of inten­tions of Rebellion? Is it possible these should be the fruits of the Spirit?

Answer.

1. Where doe you read that they Petitioned any Mur­derer to spare their lives? or sought to get any debt or rent, or right by Law? Is it therefore unlawful for you or I to do any of these? The Scriptures speak not all that ever any Prophet said or did; but so much as was necessary for us to know.

2. They did command both Princes and People to hear and obey them: They openly denounced Gods judgments against those that obeyed them not, and that abused and wronged them.

[Page 19] 3. There was not so much need then of petitioning, for the Levites and Priests had their standing portion allotted them by God; and few Jewes were so wicked as you, to deny it them.

4. When any did pinch them, God takes it as a robbing of himself: Hear once for all, what language he speaks in, that the world may know the difference between Gods language and the Divels, Mal. 3. 8, 9, 10, 11, 12. Will a man rob God? yet have ye robbed me. But ye say, Wherein have we robbed thee? In Tithes and Offerings. Ye are cursed with a curse; for ye have robbed me, even this whole nation. Bring yee all the Tithes into the Store house, that there may be meat in my house, and prove me now herewith, saith the Lord of Hosts, if I will not open you the windowes of Heaven, and pour out a blessing, that there shall not be room enough to receive it. And I will rebuke the devourer for your sakes, and he shall not destroy the fruit of your ground, neither shall your Vine cast her fruit before her time in the field, saith the Lord of Hosts. And all nations shall call you blessed, for ye shall be a delightsome Land, saith the Lord of Hosts. This was spoke both to Governors and Governed. Mark how the Apostle speaks of the proportion of Gospel Maintenance, to this Legal Maintenance. As they that serve at the Altar live of the Altar; [Even so the Lord hath ordained, that they which preach the Gospel, should live of the Gospel.] This doth not only answer all Cavils, of the ceasing of Legal Maintenance, but is a full establishment of a Gospel Maintenance, in succession to the Legal, with an [even so;] and will plainly prove the establishment of as ful a Maintenance.

5. It cannot be expected, that the Apostles should petiti­on Magistrates for Maintenance, when they were Heathens and Persecutors; they must first perswade them to be Chri­stians: They rebuke the Church for going to Law before Heathens, and not rather suffering wrong: Must we there­fore seek no Right at the hands of Christian Magistrates now? If you can either prove or make the Magistrates of England Pagans (which God prevent) then we will no more petition them for a stablished Maintenance.

[Page 20] 6. Did not Elijah do more to Baals Prophets, then any Ministers in England do by you? and Paul say more against Seducers, then we against you?

Answer.

Your Query intimates that their words import so much. If so, then I demand of you, 1. Whether a lying pen be any sign of a wise man? 2. Whether it be any sign of Wis­dom, Meekness, Humility, or the Spirit, to call Six thou­sand Persons Fools, for that which it is evident they never spake, or before you are able to understand plain english? It is the Matter of the Petition that we say, [is the same] and not the persons that we prefer it to. Nay, the contrary is expressed; for we distinguish between petitioning God and men.

Answer.

1 Blaspheming is like to be well reformed, when such as you must be the Judges of Blasphemy.

2. I desire all Parliament men and Commanders to mark what kind of men they be that are the opposers of the Mini­stry, and what dealing you are like to find from them your selves: They take it for Blasphemy to petition you; and a giving you the Honour due to Christ, for which we must be cut off.

3. But if these men are yet men, I would wish them to prove next, That it is Blasphemy and robbing God of his Ho­nour, to desire his Officers under him to do but their Duties. Paul left Titus in Crete to ordain Elders in every City, and [Page 21] set it order things that are wanting. If now many Cities had petitioned Titus to ordain them Elders, had this been Blas­phemy and robbing God of his honour? David, Solomon, Hezekiah, Josiah, &c. were to set the Priests and Levites in their order, and charge them to do their Duty: if any had petitioned them in a vacancy of the Priesthood, to have ap­pointed them Priests, had they blasphemed, when it was their duty? If any seduced Village should petition the Par­liament to let one of you be their Teacher, I do not believe you would have called it Blasphemy. Furthermore, rub your eyes a little, and consider; God bids us ask of him our dai­ly bread; the same God bids Parents give their Children, and Masters their Servants, their daily bread, (For he that provideth not for his own Family is worse then an Infidel, 1 Tim. 5. 8.) Is it Blasphemy now for a Child or Servant to ask bread daily of the Father or Master? or is it a giving them Gods glory? Nay, suppose a Parent so unnatural, or a Master so unjust, as that he will not pay a servant his wages, or give his children bread; may not the Magistrate compel him to it, and put him to death if he famish his children? Why may not you say, Children and Servants must take that which God alloweth them as well as Ministers? God hath left it to the Parent, and not determined just how much portion he shall allow his children, and yet if he wrong his child even in that, the Law of the Land may right him. God hath said to his Elect, that pray to him day and night, that he will avenge them speedily; yet if a Murderer kill your wife or child, may not you seek to the Magistrate for Justice, with­out Blasphemy? If any man would turn you out of your house and Lands, as you would do the Ministers out of theirs, may not you seek to the Magistrate to defend you by Justice? else what use have we of any Magistrates or Go­vernment?

Answer.

1. Now you vomit up the bottome of the business: I pray God preserve all friends of mine from being such proud Saints, as think it below them to petition or make Addresses to men. 2. And from being such ignorant Saints, as no better to know their priviledges, their duty, themselves or their God: And 3. from being such impudent, arrogant Saints, even Monsters of men, as to censure all as Infidels, or such as know not what God is, that ask counsel of men.

2. Why hath God set up Magistrates, if men may make no addresses to them without the guilt of Infidelity or Atheifm? Is not all power of God? Are they not by him appointed to execute wrath, as Gods Ministers, on them that do evil? and are they not the Ministers of God for good to them that do well? Rom. 13. 1, 2, 3, 4, 5. Why hath Christ ordained Officers in his Church to the end of the world, and till the Church be perfected, if we must not ask counsel of them?

3. A Lyar should have a good memory: in this Query you think [Those that ask counsel of men, believe not that God would hear them, or know not what God is:] In the very next words, in the next Query you accuse the blasphemous Cler­gy for hindering you, or such as you, from labouring in the Lords Vineyard: what labour will you use, if you will not counsel men? will you not counsel them to hear you, and o­bey Gods word, and to believe that you speak truth, &c? And if it be Infidelity and Atheisme to ask counsel of men, why do you thrust your counsel on them, and long for the Imployment? Did you not write this your Pamphlet to coun­sel men?

4. O ye, the honourable Parliament of this Com­monwealth, and all yee, the Commanders of the Army, turn your eyes hither, and see the Design of that generation of men, that are the opposers of the Ministry! It is you as well as us, that they are against. They account it no less then Infidelity, Atheism and Blasphemy, for any man to petition you, or make any addresses to you, or ask counsel of you. Do you not yet see what Birds lie in the nest, which you have [Page 23] been so tender of? you have oft heard the Prophesie, No Ceremony no Bishop, no Bishop no King: and you have seen it fulfilled. Either I have no skill in Prophecying, or else this is as true: No Ministry, no Christian Magistracy; no Christian Magistracy, no Christian Commonwealth. And all other Commonwealths are but analogically Common­wealths, being indeed but combinations of Rebels; because they are broke off from that Soveraign, who is the Head and Center of every true Commonwealth.

Answer.

1. Never age in the world, I think, under a Christian Magistrate, had less cause to complain of want of liberty for preaching; what Liberty would you have? Nay, you have the Libertie of Printing, which is more then Preach­ing.

2. Do not all know that Ministers have no power to per­secute you, or to put you out of the Vineyard? they can but perswade others to do it, and so may you by them, and do in this Pamphlet.

3. Prove your Call into the Lords Vineyard: You use to bid us prove our Call. We have the concurrence of all these 1. Gods competent qualification of us to do his work. 2. A desire to spend and to be spent for mens salvation: 3. The ordination of Christs Church Officers, appointing us to this work: 4. A willingness of mind to be joined as Officers to that particular Church, that we are called to. 5. The consent of that Church that we should be their Officers. If you say [Page 24] that we boast of what we have not in any of these: I challenge any of you to come and make good any such Accusation. If you say, We have too much in any of these particulars; then we are on the safer side the hedge; for it seems then, we want nothing essential to the Ministry. If you say, They are no Churches that consent: we shall take it for a slander till you prove it; which you will never do. Now I re­quire you to shew as full a Commission: These Papers of yours shew that gross ignorance in you, that proves you un­qualified to be common members of a Church, much more, to be Teachers. And certainly, such Railers, Slanderers, Lyars without any blushing or fear, were never sent by God to be Labourers in his Vineyard. Wonderful! that ever you can be so ignorant of your selves, so notoriously blind, so di­stracted with pride, as to think so many painful, able, hum­ble servants of Christ, worthy to be cast out as Blasphemers, Dogs, and Divels; and your selves to be the men that the Lord hath sent as Labourers into his Harvest! but Pride will burn up reason and humanitie.

2. As for the wages of the world that you so ignorantly talk of; might you not as well have accused Christ or the Apostles for appointing a worldly wages? We desire, I tell you, no more then they have allotted us. If you say, Christ constraineth none to pay Ministers. I answer, as before, Christ immediately constraineth none to pay debts, or rents, or to relieve their children; and yet Magistrates must con­strain them, for they must do Justice, which is to see that all have their Due: And this Christ hath appointed as our Due. Yet I shall shew you anon that we ask nothing at all of any man. We desire no man to give us a farthing of his own, but only to deliver us that which is ours. And for trusting Christ for our wages, I trust him heartily, and bewail my distrust: and doubt not but he will enable me to trust him, though all the stated Maintenance of Ministers were down; yea, though I found no favour from Magistrates, but opposition: Under all the wrongs of man Christ is still to be trusted. But wo to those proud wormes, that will therefore wrong Christs Mini­sters or Church; It were better for them that a milstone were [Page 25] hanged about their necks, and they were cast into the depth of the sea. And be it known to you all, that rage at Christs servants, and are contriving and endeavouring the rooting out of his Gospel, that he that falls on this stone shall be bro­ken in pieces; but (for those that would lift it out of the Nation) on whomsoever it falls, it will grind him to powder.